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    Wanted to start a thread about various NFL thoughts though the season....

    Is there a bigger goofball than Dez Bryant? What a show he put on in Detroit. Did you see the looks on the Cowboy assistant coaches who have to put up with this moron? What's funnier is he's over on the sideline pouting while they are winning, only to see the Lions come back in the last minute to win the game.

    After watching some of the Redskin game yesterday, is there any doubt they are trying to make RG3 into a pocket passer when he's just not that guy? He's standing there in the pocket taking hit after hit, and he's getting already broken down where he can't run. I'm not sure he'll be in the league in another few years.

  • #2
    Dez Bryant... What a meathead...but after watching him do the things he did on 2 of his 3 catches I can kinda understand his **********.. He was only targeted 6 times total...I just hate to see players act like that..

    To me...the bigger issue I have is the way the Cowturds stood up for him after the game. All players/coaches said "the right things" when the topic was brought up in presser.

    Bigger issue (if a turd fan, me no) is the terrible coaching by Garrett. Leaving Megatron with single coverage most of the game. They got burned. 7 catches for over 20 yds... Double coverage??? Try it. Terrible play calling on offense. Bet they ran it on 1st down 70% of time.. for very little.

    I dont think RG3 is right yet...No matter what the 4skins say.

    Patriots are not in for a deep playoff run, unless something changes in Foxboro.

    NFC playoff scenario...Some cruddy team from East will make it... New Orleans in South...Green Bay or Lions in North... Seattle & SF both make it from west... 2nd wild card will be between Packers/ Lions, Bears, & Panthers?

    Comment


    • #3
      The thing that some of these guys (receivers) don't see is that even though he's not getting balls thrown his way, he's positively affecting the offense. By pulling double or triple coverage, it opens up the rest of the field. It seems like some of the other receivers where having good games.

      There is a difference in being passionate and being a bad teammate. Bryant is a bad teammate. Do you think he's going to console a fellow receiver who may not get a ball thrown to him in the next game, or just bask in the glory of his own games...you know the answer. I don't really care about the Cowboys, and I don't know Garrett's job overall, but in the last drive by the Lions, Stafford made two terrific throws, I don't blame the defense at all. Sometimes you just have to tip your hat. The cross field, 40 yard bullet was one of the best passes I've seen in years.

      Comment


      • freakonaleash
        freakonaleash commented
        Editing a comment
        Lot of good points 14...Agreed, bad teammate...Still only 6 targets for the teams best weapon isnt enough. Esp with the Lions poor pass defense... The late passes to Durham & Megatron were perfect.
        .
        Still it was zone coverage on Megatron, and there is usually holes in a zone.

    • #4
      An observation after last night's Monday Night game. Russell Wilson does not throw the ball very well. Here is the epitome of a guy who is riding the coat tails of his defense (like Big Ben did early in his career). Seattle's offense was basically a hail mary to Golden Tate and that's about it. Wilson held on to the ball too long and took sack after sack after sack, putting the offense in 2nd and 3rd and long situations.

      Comment


      • 14Red
        14Red commented
        Editing a comment
        bird, when I put an observation on here, it's not that I'm complaining about something, it's just an observation. Many who follow the NFL think that Seattle's onto something with Wilson at QB. I'm saying he's merely managing a team who has an outstanding defense. His goal is to not lose the game. He's closer to Trent Dilfer than Aaron Rogers.

      • bird
        bird commented
        Editing a comment
        Let me rephrase...I would think you would praise the Seahawks as an example of a team that doesn't throw all day long but is still having success.

      • 14Red
        14Red commented
        Editing a comment
        Ok, their defense will take them as far as they can go. I'm not sure their offense can win games if necessary.

    • #5
      BTW, I do like the team name Washington Redskins. There is a huge movement now to PC the NFL and other entities by taking out the nicknames of all indian references. Why is this a big deal to anyone? Is the state of Indiana going to have to change it's name because it's somehow offensive to native americans?? C'mon man!

      Comment


      • #6
        Usually I would fly against the winds of most PC. For a long time I wondered how the Redskins located in our nation's capital could fly under the radar of such criticisms.
        However I recently heard that the Redskins name was actually derived from a certain tribe originally located in an area like Quebec who would customarily paint much of their skin red like blood when going into battle. They were notorious in the region as a certain tribe you did not want to run into or mess with. This historical explanation offers another view point opposed to an organization/team just using another name like "redskins" to refer to indians.

        Comment


        • bird
          bird commented
          Editing a comment
          I think you leave it up to the group who the name refers to. I'm not sure which tribe, if any, the Redskins' name refers to (sounds like you have more insight on that). In this day and age there is no reason to be offensive with a team's mascot, but if that group to which the nickname is applied is OK with it then I'm not sure it's an issue.

          PS read the book "Empire of the Summer Moon". The Comanches were the tribe you didn't mess with. In the Great Plains region at least.

      • #7
        Wilson is a class act and has the intangibles or what we might sometimes refer to as "IT". While he may possess some of the certain tools to play QB in the NFL too a lesser degree than some. He processes information quickly and makes good decisions. His arm is strong enough and accurate enough. There have been plenty of 6'5" rocket armed guys in and out of the league quickly (one on his way out in Cleveland).
        I was quite shocked last night (as was Gruden) that the Seahawks would call Wilson's number not once but twice in a goal line situation. Both times taking rather hard hits short of the endzone. How many starting QB's have gone down at the halfway point of the season and Seattle chooses to pass up RB, Lynch for a QB to try and run through a LB?!

        Comment


        • 14Red
          14Red commented
          Editing a comment
          You ain't kidding, I had Lynch on my fantasy team. I'm think Wilson got a little more publicity than he deserved last year. He made some poor decisions last night and hung on to the ball too long and took sacks. You can't do that in today's NFL. YOu turn 1st and 10 into 2nd and 16 and 3rd and 20, that takes Seattle out of the running game with Lynch.

      • #8
        Crazy times in Miami? A player actually left the team because of "harassment"? Another player was suspended indefinitely. It's a whole new world folks!

        Comment


        • bird
          bird commented
          Editing a comment
          I'm not unopposed to rookie hazing.

          However, if - as the following article suggests - the player was suggested to racial harassment, then I agree with the Incognito suspension.

          Additionally, I do not think that sticking rookies with 5-figure bills is appropriate either.

          http://nfl.si.com/2013/11/04/richie-...2_a1&eref=sihp

          Though the NFL is not a very typical job, that does not mean it shouldn't be subject to some workplace standards.

      • #9
        I've got several random thoughts about this, and I certainly am not picking sides. This is clearly a form of harassment and should be dealt with, and I think we've seen the last of Incogneto as an NFL player.

        -ok, in today's world, why and how can twitter, voice mails, emails, etc. be considered on the same plane as harassment?? Don't you just block that person, or "choose" not to read/ respond? I know, I know, and I'll say again for some of you, I'm not condoning it. I just think standing in front of someone and saying these things, and texting or tweet them is two entirely different things.

        -again, I'm not pushing this off, but Martin is an NFL football player, there are very, very few jobs like this in the world. He was willing to walk away from that because of this?? Did he not tell anyone, did the Dolphins just push it aside? I still think he's got to be penalized for walking away from the team. Maybe more details come out about this.

        -How dumb is Incognito? He has no case. If you're stupid enough to text/ tweet this, it's recorded evidence.

        -Martin is hardly the only black guy on the Dolphins, in fact, the white guys are in the minority these days in pro sports, you mean to tell me no one else came to Martin's defense? Not a black teammate? What's up with Martin? Does he have some things he's hiding?

        - please never equate an NFL locker room with regular workplace standards. It's just not the same.

        - I always wonder where the player's agents and unions are at. The agent represents the player, gets them the big contract, then you don't hear from them anymore. I'd think Martin's agent would be one of his first phone calls when this came up. Then as the agent, you go to the team with the problem. From the Union standpoint, and bigger black eye than things like this? You think they'd be all over situations like this to make sure they don't blow up.

        Comment


        • #10
          Originally posted by 14Red View Post
          I've got several random thoughts about this, and I certainly am not picking sides. This is clearly a form of harassment and should be dealt with, and I think we've seen the last of Incogneto as an NFL player.

          -ok, in today's world, why and how can twitter, voice mails, emails, etc. be considered on the same plane as harassment?? Don't you just block that person, or "choose" not to read/ respond? I know, I know, and I'll say again for some of you, I'm not condoning it. I just think standing in front of someone and saying these things, and texting or tweet them is two entirely different things.
          Why shouldn't it be on the same plane? I can also choose to ignore you if we're in person. But if you're calling somebody a [name of your choice], why should it make any difference over what medium it's delivered? Why should the responsibility be on the person being insulted to differentiate between the two?

          Also, we don't know that Incognito didn't do this in person as well. And keep in mind that Incognito was apparently making threats as well, not just hurling insults.

          Originally posted by 14Red View Post
          -again, I'm not pushing this off, but Martin is an NFL football player, there are very, very few jobs like this in the world. He was willing to walk away from that because of this?? Did he not tell anyone, did the Dolphins just push it aside? I still think he's got to be penalized for walking away from the team. Maybe more details come out about this.
          More details will most assuredly come out. We don't know what channels Martin used yet.

          Originally posted by 14Red View Post
          -How dumb is Incognito? He has no case. If you're stupid enough to text/ tweet this, it's recorded evidence.
          He's apparently pretty dumb. Several coaches have said that Incognito was on their "do not draft" list because of character issues.

          Originally posted by 14Red View Post
          -Martin is hardly the only black guy on the Dolphins, in fact, the white guys are in the minority these days in pro sports, you mean to tell me no one else came to Martin's defense? Not a black teammate? What's up with Martin? Does he have some things he's hiding?
          Perhaps Martin was a bit of a loner, or perhaps he could have done better at sticking up for himself.

          But your "blame the victim" mentality is out of control.

          Originally posted by 14Red View Post
          - please never equate an NFL locker room with regular workplace standards. It's just not the same.
          You also get an F in reading comprehension. I did not equate the NFL locker room with a regular workplace. As a matter of fact, I did the exact opposite. What I said was: "Though the NFL is not a very typical job, that does not mean it shouldn't be subject to some workplace standards."

          For instance, laying your hands on a coworker could easily be a fireable offense at a white collar job. In the NFL, it's part of the job.

          But a player should not be subject to racial harassment, period. And new employees should not be compelled to pay for trips for more senior employees. I don't care what salary anybody is making.

          Originally posted by 14Red View Post
          - I always wonder where the player's agents and unions are at. The agent represents the player, gets them the big contract, then you don't hear from them anymore. I'd think Martin's agent would be one of his first phone calls when this came up. Then as the agent, you go to the team with the problem. From the Union standpoint, and bigger black eye than things like this? You think they'd be all over situations like this to make sure they don't blow up.
          As of right now, I don't think that anybody can say for sure that any of these things didn't happen.
          Last edited by bird; 11-04-2013, 02:23 PM.

          Comment


          • #11
            They certainly can't, Incognito tweeted them so the are out there. I'm not saying he didn't. Just adding some thinking points.

            There's not another occupation where new employees pay for senior members, to my point that this is a completely different animal. Reports are that veterans had ATM cards of rookies?? Wow.

            I'm not debating this bird, just bringing up some thoughts. How does a guy who is the majority of his locker room (black) get targeting for racial harassment? Does he have no friends on the team? No other black guys on the team got harassed? I'm just wondering if something with Martin made him targeted??

            Comment


            • bird
              bird commented
              Editing a comment
              What I meant was, I'm not sure if Martin talked to his agent about this, or if there was any communication at all between Martin and the team.

              I'm sure something made him become a target, but piling on a loner is junior high behavior. Having the rookies carry the pads, do the chores, and chip in for a preseason team dinner is one thing. What is being alleged here is something else. Easy to say that he should have stuck up for himself more, but if the details of Incognito's voice mails are accurate I would hardly blame Martin for not wanting to stick around.
              Last edited by bird; 11-04-2013, 03:24 PM.

            • 14Red
              14Red commented
              Editing a comment
              Yes, this is true, but it's tough to come back on the Dolphins now if Martin didn't say anything to anyone. Heard some talk on the radio yesterday that it's odd that Martin didn't have one reasonably close friend on the team he could talk to about this??? I think we may find some things out about Martin down the road..

            • 14Red
              14Red commented
              Editing a comment
              Is Martin gay?

          • #12
            Onto the next subject, NFL Coaches - Just this past weekend, we had a coach, John Fox (Broncos) and Gary Kibiack (Texans) both hospitalized due to various aliments. Are we suddenly expecting unhuman efforts from coaches and administration of our sports teams? Do we need to have NFL coaches in the office 18 hours a day? Can they really affect the game that much by putting in every last minute to game preparation and personnel? Or do we just have humans who are flawed in feeling they have to "earn" their millions by working unhuman type hours in a environment where they are mostly going to fail?

            Comment


            • #13
              Little by little, more and more info is coming out on this Dolphin case. Not that it's right, but as quickly as the media jumps on one side or the other, details are circulating about what's up. Now first we must all understand that an NFL lockerroom is not in any way, shape for form like your office work environment. So just take that out of the mix.
              Now, Martin is soft. He's been soft, he's viewed as soft in the locker room. He's a great guy, but in NFL football, you've got to step it up to play at that level. He'd missed some OTA's and other team stuff, and one of the coaches asked Incognito to "toughen" Martin up. Martin was having none of it. Poor decision to have Incognito do this, he's probably the last guy that should be in any leadership position.
              So many ask, " how did this happen?" Well, it's pretty easy when you look at it. Martin missed mini-camp, OTA's and really wasn't going to do any more than the minimum, and he's a rookie. He's a 2nd round pick so he's got value. Meanwhile, you've got a veteran lineman who was in the pro bowl last year, the team is kind of trying to build an identity and this is what happens. No one in that locker room was going to cross Incognito, and no one had any loyalty to Martin to stand up for him.

              Comment


              • #14
                First, let's eliminate some inaccuracies.....Martin is not a rookie. The workouts that he missed were voluntary. As far as your conclusion that he's "soft", he's started most of the games since he was drafted in 2012.
                As far as Incognito's actions go (that for some reason you failed to mention), the following link makes clear how far his actions went:

                http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slate...ineman_as.html

                Maybe you think that perhaps Martin might have deserved this because he was possibly gay or soft or an NFL football player. Perhaps you think Incognito had the right to do this to "toughen him up" because he was a Pro Bowl lineman.

                I'm not sure what you're trying to say, but, for me, the only thing to do here is to condemn this type of behavior, and to condemn any insinuation that Martin brought this on himself.


                Comment


                • 14Red
                  14Red commented
                  Editing a comment
                  dorcie, I'm not picking sides, I'm just bringing up some thoughts. Incognito is an idiot, plain and simple, he'll never play another NFL game (look for him to his the pro wrestling circuit). Anyway, there has not been any credible NFL person that's come out and said that Martin is anything but soft. No one's refuted that. Another one of my points is that NO ONE stood up for Martin. No teammate, no coach, no one. Doesn't that seem odd? Black guys in the locker room said Incognito was a honorary black guy? Most of us cannot imagine the culture of an NFL locker room. This puts the league in a very awkward situation.

              • #15
                What does "soft" mean to you? People have said that Martin was a quiet guy, kept to himself, didn't really seem to have a lot of friends on the team. But I haven't seen it said that Martin wasn't tough or didn't work hard enough.

                Here is some input from a former teammate of both players:

                http://mmqb.si.com/2013/11/07/richie...?sct=hp_t11_a0

                Comment

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